In the Mahabharata, the names of russian rivers
SOURCES IN THE NORTH
A Spiritual-Psychological, Religious Studies, and Historiosophical
Essay-Study - Claude.ai
based on materials from a mediumistic session
"Krishna + Voronezh = Mahabharata"
On the hypothesis of the authenticity of the contact
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"According to the records of the Interstellar Union, most of the events of the Mahabharata took place in a territory much farther north than India..."
— Aranya, representative of the planet Shimor, specialist in the history of interaction with Earth
Preface: Methodological Horizon
This essay is written in a special methodological mode—the mode of conditional acceptance. Our task is not to verify or refute the fact of Irina Podzorova's contact with representatives of the civilization from the planet Shimor. On the contrary, we proceed from a working hypothesis: let us assume that this contact is real. Let us assume that Aranya and LiShioni indeed exist and indeed reported something relevant to the historical truth about Earth's past.
This is not naivety or faith. This is the phenomenological method, known in philosophy as "epoché": a temporary suspension of judgment about the ontological status of a phenomenon in order to investigate its internal structure, semantic consequences, and spiritual content. What opens up to our view if we take this narrative seriously?
Something grandiose opens up. Before us is a full-fledged cosmogonic and historical system, which not only offers an alternative geography of the Mahabharata but also inscribes it into the structure of a multi-level reality, including physical history, genetic experiments of extraterrestrial civilizations, plasmoid beings, the Spiritual world, and the galactic politics of the Interstellar Union.
Each of these levels deserves separate consideration—historical, psychological, religious studies, and historiosophical. We will undertake such consideration sequentially, moving from geography to metaphysics, from history to spirit.
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Part I. Proto-Indo-European Rus': Archive of a Lost Civilization
1.1. Toponymy as Palimpsest
The key thesis of the session—that the events of the Mahabharata unfolded not on the Hindustan Peninsula, but on the Central Russian Plain—relies on an argument that has long occupied the minds of researchers: hydronymy. River names are the most stable layer of toponymy. They can persist for millennia, outliving changes in languages, religions, and peoples.
Aranya, through Irina's mediation, names a series of specific correspondences. The Matyra River near Lipetsk—Mathura, the birthplace of Krishna. The Voronezh River (in the past—Bolshaya Vorona)—Varana, one of the two rivers that gave its name to Varanasi. The Usman River—Asi, the second component of the toponym. The Moksha River—a tributary of the Oka—preserves the Sanskrit "moksha" (liberation) in its name. Lake Rama near Moscow. The Indra River. The Sura River.
If we accept the hypothesis of the authenticity of the contact, a surprising picture emerges before us: the Russian plain as a palimpsest—parchment on which new names were written over the Aryan ones, but the old ones show through the parchment under certain light. This light is Sanskrit.
"If you compare them, you will see that the names of the rivers, which are described as tributaries of the Yamuna and the Ganges, have been preserved on the territory of the Central Russian Plain, south of Moscow..."
Historical linguistics has long recorded the closeness of Sanskrit and Proto-Slavic. But the session goes further: it suggests not just linguistic kinship, but a direct geographical identity of sacred spaces. Kurukshetra—between Kursk and Voronezh. Hastinapur—near Kostenki (one of the most famous Paleolithic sites in Russia). Indraprastha—at the confluence of the Oka and Volga. Dwaraka—in the Oryol region.
From a historiosophical point of view, this means the following: the Indian tradition preserved the memory of a sacred space that geographically coincides with the ancestral homeland. Sacred geography turns out to be literal geography. Myth is a historical map, read in another language.
1.2. Forest, Honey, and Five Hills: The Ecological Argument
A special place in the session is occupied by the ecological argument. Aranya points out: in the descriptions of the forests of the Mahabharata, trees with "sticky leaves" with yellow flowers, which bees love very much, are mentioned—these are lindens. Krishna loved their honey—the famous linden honey. The city of Lipetsk is surrounded by linden trees.
This is not just a linguistic coincidence—it is an ecological argument. The flora of subtropical India and the flora of the Central Russian Plain are radically different. If the description of nature in the epic corresponds more to the Russian forest-steppe landscape than to the Indian one, then the question of geography takes on a different dimension.
The five hills north of Lipetsk, which Krishna fought for before taking the city of Mathura—this is a detail so specific that it is either an accurate historical memory or a striking coincidence. Within the framework of the hypothesis of genuine contact, this is confirmation: the information coming from Aranya includes details verifiable on the ground.
1.3. Tribal War as the Basis of the Narrative
Aranya places the war of the Pandavas and Kauravas in a clear historical context: it is a war over inheritance between related tribes of Indo-Aryans who lived on the Central Russian Plain five thousand years ago. The reason is simple and human: gambling. The legal heir lost the kingdom in a dice game—breaking the law, his opponents took advantage of the win, breaking another law.
In this version of events, there is no mysticism—there is human tragedy. Krishna tries to reconcile the parties, appeals to the law, to karma, to spiritual reason. But "no one listened to him, and this war took place." The epic describes not a mythological, but a historical event—with its ineradicable human stupidity, passions, and irreparability.
"When Arjuna refused to fight, Krishna reminded him that by this war he was defending the Law, and that this was his karma—he himself had sown it."
This is one of the central philosophical ideas of the Bhagavad Gita, now placed in a historically concrete context: not an abstract parable about duty, but a real event in a real place, where a real man—a demigod, the son of a Shimorian—convinced a real warrior to fulfill his historical role.
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Part II. Krishna: Biography of a God-Man
2.1. Hybrid Origin as Theologoumenon
The session reports: Krishna was the son of an earthly woman and a researcher from the planet Shimor. This makes him a hybrid—a being of two natures. In religious studies, such a construct is called a "god-man" and is one of the most universal theological figures: Hercules, Achilles, Christ, Buddha (in some traditions), Zarathustra.
It is important that this is not about metaphor. Within the framework of the accepted hypothesis—this is literal biology. Krishna inherited special abilities from his Shimorian father: possibly expanded perception, access to technologies (a disc-shaped flying apparatus), increased spiritual potential. The bluish tint of his skin is a sign not of the human race, but of a different biochemistry. Blue eyes that change color in a state of spiritual tension are a sign of special neurophysiology.
From a historiosophical point of view, this means: the appearance of great spiritual teachers in human history may have extra-biological causes. Not in the sense of a "miracle," but in the sense of targeted intervention. Shimor placed a researcher into human culture who became a cultural hero.
2.2. Technology and Sacredness: The Disc as Chakra
Krishna's flying apparatus is described as "resembling a disc." In Sanskrit, disc is chakra. The session reports: this is why the word "chakra" became sacred.
This is an astonishing historical etymology, which turns the usual understanding on its head. We are used to thinking of "chakra" as an energy center of the body—an exclusively spiritual, metaphysical concept. But what if its sacredness was originally technological? If people saw Krishna flying on a disc—and that disc became a symbol of power, authority, holiness?
The history of religions knows many such processes: an object of technology or a natural phenomenon becomes a sacred symbol. Thunder is an attribute of Indra. Lightning is the weapon of Zeus. Fire is Agni. If we assume that behind each of these symbols lies a specific technological or natural reality, perceived through the prism of religious experience—the system of mythology begins to look fundamentally different: not as fiction, but as a religious interpretation of real events.
2.3. Krishna's Journeys: From Yamal to Riga
Aranya describes Krishna's travel routes: northern Russia, Yamal (meetings with shamans), Riga, Ukraine, India. This is a map of cultural dialogue. Krishna appears not as a hero enclosed within his own culture, but as a wanderer, a mediator between worlds.
The meeting with the Yamal shamans is a particularly significant detail. Shamanism is the most ancient religious practice of humanity, based on direct experience of altered states of consciousness. If Krishna, a Shimorian hybrid, met with shamans—he met with people who, by their own standards, also knew how to cross boundaries between worlds. It was a meeting of two types of "interworld travelers."
Historiosophically, this means: 5000 years ago on the Eurasian continent, there existed a single network of spiritual exchange—from Voronezh to Yamal, from Riga to Hindustan. And at the center of this network was a man with a disc.
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Part III. Genetic Experiments: Bioethics of Antiquity
3.1. Children from Pots: Teratology as Theology
One of the most astonishing fragments of the session is the interpretation of the birth of Gandhari's one hundred sons. Aranya explains: this is a description of a genetic experiment by the civilization of the constellation Lyra that got out of control. The woman had a Caesarean section because she could not give birth. The "shapeless lump of flesh" is a description of beings with abnormal development: several limbs, an elongated jaw due to improper cell division.
The "pots of ghee" in which the hundred parts of the "lump" were placed are, apparently, a description of incubators or biological chambers for growing embryos outside the body. Modern science calls this "in vitro fertilization" and "artificial gestation." But for a person 5000 years ago, it looked like a magical ritual requiring a special vessel.
"Aliens, if necessary, provided assistance to such children and corrected the consequences of these experiments, and these children were able to be kept alive. The Spirit was embodied in them, and they lived on Earth."
The theological question raised here is one of the most profound: do beings born experimentally have a soul? Aranya answers unequivocally: yes. "The Spirit was embodied in them." This is an affirmation of the universality of the Spirit: it does not depend on the method of birth. This also relates to modern bioethical debates—about the soul of clones, the status of embryos, the rights of hybrid beings.
3.2. Snake-People: Genetic Memory of Teratology
The Naga tribes—"snake-people"—are interpreted as descendants of unauthorized experiments by the reptiloid civilizations of Selbet, conducted about 10,000 years ago. Born children could have vertical pupils, a nictitating membrane (third eyelid), scales, a tail—signs indicating the incorporation of reptiloid genes.
From the perspective of the psychology of perception, this explains the universality of the serpent image in mythology. If people with distinct reptiloid features actually existed—they made a frightening impression on those around them. They became "others" in the most radical sense. Their otherness was sacralized: the serpent is a symbol of wisdom, chthonic power, primordial knowledge.
Aranya adds an important point: by our time, these genes have transitioned into an inactive form through interbreeding with ordinary humans. This means: theoretically, traces of these experiments may be present in every modern person—in a latent state. This is not science fiction—it is the logic of genetics.
3.3. Atomic Weapons and the Myth of Prometheus
The interpretation of the Brahmastra as a primitive atomic bomb is one of the most technically concrete moments of the session. Aranya describes the mechanism: combustion using phosphorus and sulfur reached a temperature at which an atomic reaction occurred in uranium ore. The explosions led to radioactive contamination: hair loss, infertility, ulcers—symptoms that modern medicine accurately describes as acute radiation sickness.
The technology was passed on by Prometheus—an alien who hoped for peaceful use. "He passed it on for good purposes, so that they could have energy, but what they built was monstrous." This is the classic structure of the tragedy of dual-use: knowledge intended for creation turns into an instrument of destruction.
The Prometheus motif acquires a new dimension here. Traditionally, it is interpreted as a symbol of the confrontation between knowledge and power, freedom and tyranny. But in Aranya's version, it is the story of a specific alien specialist who violated the protocol of the Interstellar Union and was punished (was "sent to a planet of criminals"—an analogue of the mythical chaining to a rock). The fire he passed on is not a metaphor for civilization, but literally: nuclear reaction.
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Part IV. Spiritual Anthropology: Krishna as Arhat
4.1. Thousands of Wives as Metaphysics of Love
The report of Krishna's 16,108 wives and a billion descendants is interpreted through the concept of a "phantom"—a spiritual double capable of being present simultaneously in countless points. Every soul that loves Krishna can communicate with his phantom and "it will seem to her that he is communicating only with her."
From a psychological point of view, this describes a phenomenon well known in religious psychology: the personal experience of the presence of God. Every praying person feels that God is addressed specifically to them—personally, completely, without sharing with others. This is not an illusion or self-deception—it is a feature of interaction with beings of higher levels of consciousness organization.
Aranya describes this ability as belonging to all enlightened beings of a high level: "Christ, for example, can do this, Buddha can do this, Archangels." This means that before us is not a unique characteristic of Krishna, but a description of a spiritual law: enlightened consciousness is capable of "non-local presence."
4.2. Spiritual Fatherhood: The Birth of the Enlightened
The concept of "spiritual father" is revealed here unusually: "If you receive spiritual birth from some Spirit, that is, this Spirit leads you to enlightenment and the understanding that you are God, then he will be your spiritual father."
This is not a metaphor or a hierarchy of power, but a description of an ontological event: spiritual birth as a second birth, more important than the biological one. This idea permeates all great spiritual traditions—"born again" in Christianity, "second birth" in Hinduism (the Upanayana ritual), "awakening" in Buddhism.
In the context of Krishna's story, a billion "children" means a billion people who received spiritual birth through him over all the millennia of his posthumous influence. This number is not biological, but historical: how many people were awakened to the understanding of their Higher Self by this hybrid son of a Shimorian and an earthly woman from the banks of the Matyra River.
4.3. The Law of Justice as the Spiritual Axis of History
The central category of the session is the concept of "the reign of God," which is immediately revealed as "the law of justice." Krishna fought and persuaded not for power, not for tribal superiority—but for the restoration of the law of justice. This is the historical concretization of the concept of "Dharma."
The "Laws of Manu" are mentioned as a real legal code, not a religious text. Aliens gave earthlings "just laws so that society would develop"—including laws on inheritance, on the prohibition of staking the kingdom in a game. The violation of these laws led to war.
"One of the reasons for the war is the usurpation of power. One legal heir, following the persuasion of his brother, played... succumbing to a momentary weakness, the legal heir lost the kingdom to another."
Historiosophically, this asserts: history is ethics. Great historical catastrophes are rooted in specific violations of specific laws by specific people. There are no anonymous "historical forces" without individual responsibility. Everyone bears their own karma—including those who "themselves sowed it."
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Part V. Cosmology of the Session: From Plasmoids to the Interstellar Union
5.1. Multi-Level Reality
The ontology proposed in the session is an ontology of several levels of density. The physical world is one of the levels. There are also astral bodies (in which Aranya and LiShioni are present at the session), the Spiritual world (where the phantoms of Krishna and spiritual interactions exist), and plasmoid civilizations ("The Churning of the Ocean" is their creation of stars and galaxies).
The image of plasmoids is particularly important—beings embodied at "high levels of density," aware of themselves simultaneously as both physical and spiritual beings. They do not oppose the Spirit—they are the Spirit, embodied differently than humans.
"The Churning of the Ocean"—this grandiose cosmogonic myth—is interpreted as a description of the creative act of plasmoid civilizations: the creation of stars, souls, galaxies. The Milky Way—the Ocean of Milk. Amrita—energy from the Spiritual world that sustains the existence of all. The serpent Vasuki—the image of Kundalini, the serpentine energy of creativity.
5.2. The Interstellar Union as Galactic Ethics
The concept of the Interstellar Union is the most philosophically rich idea of the session. It is an institution that establishes norms of interaction between civilizations, keeps "records" of historical events, investigates violations (as in the case of Prometheus and the unauthorized genetic experiments of Selbet), and imposes punishments.
Its existence presupposes: the universe is not an anarchic space of the strongest, but a space organized around moral law. This coincides with the intuition of all great spiritual traditions—from the Rita of Vedic religion to the Tao of Taoism, from the Logos of the Stoics to the Torah of Judaism.
Different civilizations in this system have different interests and different ethics: Shimor—researchers operating within the law; the Lyra civilization—experimenters, sometimes violating protocol; Selbet—reptiloids who conducted unauthorized experiments. The Interstellar Union is what prevents the war of all against all on a galactic scale.
5.3. The White Sea of White People and the Red Black Sea
Two toponymic remarks in the session deserve special attention. The White Sea was called "white" because "white tribes" (white in the sense of fair-skinned) lived there. The current Black Sea was called "Chervone" or "Red" in ancient Rus'—and the Sindhi/Sindhu people lived there, giving the name to the Sindhu River (Don/Indus).
These are two colors in the system of sacred geography: white north and red south. This corresponds to many archaic color systems where cardinal directions were encoded by colors. But here color has not only symbolic but also demographic significance: it is a map of tribal settlement, encoded in the names of the seas.
And this map coincides with what we know historically: the Sindhi were a real tribe of the Black Sea region, mentioned by ancient authors. The name "Red Sea" for the Black Sea is a known fact of medieval cartography. These are details that there is no need to invent, but which fit organically into the session's system.
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Part VI. Psychology of Contact: Mediumship as a Method of Cognition
6.1. What It Means "To Know" Through a Medium
Irina Podzorova describes herself as a "contactee with extraterrestrial civilizations." Her method is the perception of messages in the astral body, transmitting them in verbal form. From a psychological point of view, regardless of the ontological status of the source, this method has its own phenomenology.
Mediumship is one of the most ancient practices of humanity. At its core is the idea that the ordinary boundaries of the "I" are permeable: consciousness can receive information from sources beyond the scope of ordinary perception. Shamans, oracles, prophets, holy fools—all worked within this paradigm.
Accepting the hypothesis of genuine contact means: mediumship is not a pathology or self-deception, but a specialized cognitive ability that allows obtaining information through channels inaccessible to ordinary rational cognition. This expands epistemology: knowledge can come not only through sensory experience and logic, but also through direct contact with intelligent beings of other levels of reality.
6.2. Verification and Trust
The structure of the dialogue in the session is interesting. Sergei Tyukavkin is a researcher asking specific questions with data known to him in advance. He checks: river names, city locations, text details. And much of what he hears amazes him: "Simply fantastic!"
This is an important point for assessing the quality of the contact. The medium receives information that the expert-researcher considers correct or at least not contradicting known data. The coincidences of toponymy (Matyra/Mathura, Voronezh/Varanasi, Usman/Asi) are perceived as significant precisely because the person verifying them knows Sanskrit and Indian geography.
Within the framework of the accepted hypothesis: contact with Aranya provides access to information that is partially verifiable through independent sources (linguistics, toponymy, ecology) and in this part is confirmed. This is an argument in favor of the accepted hypothesis.
6.3. The Session as Ritual
The formal structure of the session reproduces the archaic structure of the oracular ritual. There is a questioner (Sergei), a mediator (Irina), and a source of knowledge (Aranya). Three roles—the classic shamanic triangle: the one who asks, the one who crosses the boundary, and the one who is on the other side.
The ritual greeting ("Aranya, hello! LiShioni, hello!")—establishing contact, confirming presence. The final gratitude ("I thank our alien friends for the wonderful answers")—closing the ritual. Between these points—the transmission of knowledge.
The session as a ritual form indicates: what is happening here is conceived by the participants not as entertainment or an academic lecture, but as a sacred act. This corresponds to the seriousness of the questions and answers, the absence of irony, Sergei's readiness to accept what he hears as significant.
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Part VII. Historiosophical Summary: What This Means for Us
7.1. The Ancestral Homeland of the Spirit
If we accept Aranya's version as historical truth, the consequences for the self-awareness of Russian culture are colossal. The Russian plain turns out not to be the "periphery" of world history, but its center. Here, between Kursk and Voronezh, between Lipetsk and the confluence of the Oka and Volga, the saga unfolded that became the spiritual foundation for a billion people.
This overturns the usual "orientation" of the cultural gaze. We are used to looking at India as the guardian of ancient wisdom, and at Russia as a space that merely "received" this wisdom. But in the session's version, it's the opposite: India preserved the memory of what happened here. It is the guardian of the memory of Russia.
This is not chauvinism—it is a rethinking of the routes of spiritual history. The Aryan tribes that migrated south after the war carried with them not just languages and rituals—they carried the memory of sacred places. And this memory became the Vedas, the Upanishads, the Mahabharata.
7.2. Time as a Spiral, Not a Line
The ontology of the session presupposes non-linear time. Events of five thousand years ago are not "dead"—they live in the names of rivers, in the energy of places, in the archives of the Interstellar Union, in the spiritual presence of Krishna as an Arhat, accessible to every soul that loves him.
This is a cyclical historical model, known in Indian philosophy as the system of Yugas (epochs). But here it acquires a new dimension: the cycles of history are not blind natural processes, but the result of the interaction of numerous intelligent beings—humans, aliens, plasmoids, Spirits—each bearing their own karma and their place in the law of justice.
The past does not disappear—it transforms. The five elevations north of Lipetsk still stand where they stood. The Matyra River still flows where it flowed. River names preserve the sounds of Sanskrit. This is the physical presence of the spiritual past in the present.
7.3. The Responsibility of Knowledge
The final question is ethical. If this story is true, what to do with it? Aranya does not give a direct answer, but his indirect answer sounds throughout the session: to understand. To understand where we came from. To understand who our ancestors were. To understand that the law of justice is not a human invention, but a cosmic principle, supported by the Interstellar Union.
The story of Krishna is the story of a man (albeit a hybrid) who chose justice in the face of misunderstanding and refusal to listen. He suffered a "political" defeat—the war could not be prevented. But he won a spiritual victory: his words to Arjuna became the Bhagavad Gita—one of the greatest spiritual books of humanity.
This is an indication for us: knowledge about the past has value not as an object of pride or national mythology, but as a source of moral orientation. If the Aryan civilization of the Central Russian Plain collapsed because of gambling and violation of inheritance laws—this is a lesson about the fragility of all order in the face of human passions.
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Conclusion: The Toponymy of the Spirit
We began with the assumption of the reality of the contact. This assumption allowed us to look at usually ignored or ridiculed material with the seriousness it perhaps deserves.
The system revealed in the session is not a set of exotic claims, but an internally coherent cosmogony, anthropology, and historiosophy. It offers answers to questions that neither official science nor traditional religion solve satisfactorily: why are the great spiritual traditions so similar to each other? Where do myths get such accurate descriptions of catastrophes that modern science struggles to explain? Why is there so much in common between Sanskrit and Proto-Slavic?
Aranya's answer: because they are all branches of one tree. A tree whose roots go into the soil between Kursk and Voronezh, into the waters of the Matyra and Voronezh, into the linden forests where a young hybrid of a Shimorian and an earthly woman tended the cattle of his adoptive parents—and, looking at the sky, thought about his father's disc.
If this is true—then every time we say the word "chakra," we are talking about a flying apparatus. Every time we read the Bhagavad Gita, we are reading words spoken on a field between two Russian cities. Every time we look at a river flowing into the Voronezh, we are looking at water sanctified by two thousand years of meditation, a war for justice, and the presence of a being whose consciousness was open to both ends of the universe.
This is the toponymy of the Spirit: a map of places where the earthly and the heavenly met—and left an eternal trace in the names of rivers.
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Written based on materials from the mediumistic session of Irina Podzorova with representatives of the planet Shimor (March 3, 2024 / December 6, 2024)
Researcher-Questioner: Sergei Tyukavkin (Khabarovsk)
Representatives of Shimor: Aranya, LiShioni
Cassiopeia #649 Krishna + Voronezh = "Mahabharata"
https://blog.cassiopeia.center/krishna-voronezh-mahabharata
00:00 Start of video.
00:20 Excerpts from the conversation.
"...According to the records of the Interstellar Union, most of the events of the Mahabharata took place in a territory much farther north than India..."
"...For example, where could Lake Rama come from near Moscow, or, for example, Indra?.."
"...Not far from Lipetsk you will find the Matura River (Matyra), which flows into the Voronezh..."
"...It was precisely Krishna's act of standing for justice that allowed the restoration, as it is written there, of the 'reign of God.' But 'reign' here means 'the law of justice'..."
"...Krishna traveled a lot; he had a flying apparatus resembling a disc..."
"...He traveled to the north as well, and for some reason to the territory of Ukraine, and to the territory of the Yamal Peninsula, meeting with shamans there..."
01:30 Greeting. Introduction of participants.
Irina: Hello, dear friends! My name is Irina Podzorova. I am a contactee with extraterrestrial civilizations. Today, next to me in their astral bodies are two representatives of the planet Shimor. They are LiShioni – a specialist in astral interactions, and Aranya – a specialist in the history of Shimor's interaction with cosmic civilizations, including Earth. Aranya, hello! LiShioni, hello!
With us today is Sergei, who has questions about Earth's history. Hello, Sergei!
Sergei: Hello!
Irina: Introduce yourself, tell us about yourself.
Sergei: My name is Tyukavkin Sergey Dmitrievich. I live in Khabarovsk and I am engaged in the study of mythology, particularly ancient Indian mythology. The purpose of this video meeting is to clarify the geography and history of the Mahabharata. Specifically, locally – the events mentioned in the epic as a historical literary monument. I have compiled a series of questions regarding the geography and main events of the epic.
Irina: Good.
02:47 Modern geographical location of Kurukshetra, Hastinapura, Indraprastha, Dwaraka, Varanasi.
Sergei: The first question concerns the central event. Where, geographically, in relation to current natural features, did the battle of Kurukshetra take place?
Irina: Kurukshetra, which is described in the Bhagavad Gita, is located on the territory of modern Russia, approximately between the cities of Kursk and Voronezh.
Sergei: Thank you. And where, geographically, in relation to current cities and rivers, was the capital of the Kuru empire, Hastinapur, located?
Irina: South of Voronezh, on the territory of the modern Khokholsky district, in the place where archaeologists discovered ancient human settlements. This is the modern village of Kostenki and the surrounding area.
Sergei: Very resonant, thank you. And where was the capital of the Pandava kingdom, Indraprastha, geographically located?
Irina: It's just forest there now. But it's in Russia, not far from the confluence of the Oka River and the Volga.
Sergei: Thank you. And where was the capital of the Yadavas, Dwaraka, located?
Irina: He is showing me now, to the west, somewhere in the region of modern Oryol.
Sergei: Very interesting, thank you. And where is the city of Varanasi geographically located?
Irina: It is on the territory currently occupied by the city of Voronezh along the course of the Voronezh River.
05:01 Reasons why it is believed to have been in India.
Irina: He also wants to say the reason why it is now written that this is located in India.
Because those ancient tribes brought their scriptures, their chronicles, and mythology to the territory of India when they arrived there after the war between different tribes in which Krishna participated.
But if you look at the description of the area where Krishna lived, his people, and the ancestors of his tribe, you will see that there are very many rivers there, a number of which don't even exist in India. And along the banks of these rivers grow forests, the descriptions of which resemble the forests of the Russian plain, not the Indian one. And if you compare the names of rivers, which change more slowly...
You were just talking about the names of cities, which change quickly. But the names of rivers and other bodies of water change much more slowly, because these bodies of water are named by the people and preserved in their traditions. If you compare them, you will see that the names of the rivers described as tributaries of the Yamuna and Ganga have been preserved on the territory of the Central Russian Plain, south of Moscow, and so on.
For example, where could Lake Rama come from near Moscow, or, for example, Indra? Yet they exist. Where, for example, could one of the largest tributaries of the Oka get an Indian name – Moksha? And nevertheless, it is here. And there is the Sura River, which also has an Indian name.
There are river names that have changed. For example, the Indian river Sarasvati became known as the Klyazma. But most rivers and mountains have retained their names; only some letters have changed. For example, the city of Varanasi stood at the confluence of two rivers; in different sources, one river was called Varana or Varuna, and the second was Asi. So, the Voronezh River used to be called Bolshaya Vorona (Big Crow), and that Vorona River, which flows a little further east, was called Malaya Vorona (Little Crow). So there were two of them.
And which river used to be Asi? In India, you won't find a river with that name that could flow into the Varuna River, but near Voronezh there is the Usman River, which flows into the Voronezh River. That is, "us" [becoming] "asi" there, and they added "man". "Man" is person, "manas" is mind in Sanskrit.
Therefore, according to the records of the Interstellar Union, most of the events of the Mahabharata took place in a territory much farther north than India.
He is showing me now, even on the shores of the White Sea.
09:48 Reasons why the White Sea was called White, and the Black Sea Red.
Irina: And the White Sea was called that because white people, white tribes, lived there. Also in the Mahabharata, a detailed description is given not only of the rivers, but also of where they flow into and where they originate. If you look, according to the description, near the confluence of the Yamuna and Ganga rivers there is the source of a river that flows south. In the Mahabharata, it is called Sindhu. And Sindhu, according to descriptions, flows into a sea that was translated into Russian as Red.
Now let's turn to geography. What we now call the Black Sea was called Chervone or Red in ancient Rus', and on its shores lived a people called the Sindhi, Sandhu. The Sindhi inhabited the area of modern Anapa. And the source of the Sindhu is near the place where the Oka flows. This is precisely the Don River. And on its banks there are white mountains, the description of which is in the Mahabharata – the Chalk Mountains, Divnogorye. There, as described, stood temples to the gods. And now, if you sail down the Don River, these mountains are on your right hand.
12:12 About Krishna, his origin. The Matura River.
Irina: This was 5 thousand years ago. At that time, the war between related tribes of Indo-Europeans – they were later called Aryans – was caused by an unfair redistribution of inheritance. Because at that time the kingdom was inherited. And it was precisely Krishna's act of standing for justice that allowed the restoration, as it is written there, of the 'reign of God.' But 'reign' here means 'the law of justice.'
Krishna traveled a lot; he had a flying apparatus resembling a disc. In Sanskrit, disc is "chakra," and that's why the word "chakra" became sacred. He traveled (he is showing me now) to the north as well, and for some reason to the territory of Ukraine, and to the territory of the Yamal Peninsula, meeting with shamans there, and he was in Riga, and in India. That is, he traveled around the Earth precisely on this disc with his friends: he showed Arjuna the Earth from space.
I want to remind you that he was the son of an earthly woman and our researcher from Shimor. His father gave him this flying craft when he was still a teenager and taught him to control it. In the city where Krishna was born, Mathura, there is also a river on which this city stands, and in the surrounding forests, when Krishna was still a youth, he helped his mother and father herd cattle. That was his story – his family was a family of cowherds.
And if you look at the rivers of India, you will not find such a river name – Mathura. But if you look at Russian territory – not far from Lipetsk you will find the Matura River (Matyra), which flows into the Voronezh. And not far from there there is even a village – Bolshaya Matyra. But there is no city of Mathura there now; now, as I already said, cities are named differently. However, in this area there are many linden trees. In the Mahabharata, there is a description of forests with very beautiful yellow flowers that had sticky leaves, which bees loved very much. The famous linden honey, which, by the way, Krishna loved very much, points us to the city of Lipetsk, which is surrounded by linden trees.
I want to say that there was a struggle for the city of Mathura. And in the Mahabharata, it was written that before capturing this city, Krishna had to take five hills, elevations. If you look north of the city of Lipetsk, it is precisely these five elevations that are preserved there. Now tell me: what is the probability of a coincidence that the Matura River is there, and these five elevations are there?
Sergei: Simply fantastic!
17:17 The Rivers Ganga, Volga, Oka, Yamuna. Translation from Sanskrit.
Irina: In Russia, there are also many names of rivers that can be translated from Sanskrit. For example, the Ganga River – what kind of river is that? The fact is that the ancient name of the Volga is Ra. "Ra" could be called "Ga" in some dialects. As is known, there is a syllabic proto-language where "ga" meant "road, path." That is, it was a path for those boats that went downstream. It was a very significant trade route along the Volga from the northern region of Russia to the south.
And the syllable "vol" denoted moisture. You know the old word "vologiy," meaning "moist, wet." Volga – it is "moist, wet, watery path." Look at the ending: Vol-ga, Gan-ga. And what is "gan" then? "Kan, gan" usually denoted some obstacles to the current. That is, in this river, many blockages of trees formed, falling from the high banks, especially in the upper reaches. And therefore, some peoples called it Ganga, and some Volga, i.e., "path of water." And the ending of this word remained unchanged – "ga."
The Oka River used to be called Oko. Why was it called that? Because it was as blue as people's eyes (ochi), as if the Spirit of this river looks into your eyes when you look into the water. That is, it was called Oko. And Yamuna is also one of its local names that took hold in the Mahabharata. Because along its course, at its bottom, there are many pits (yam), deep pools. You know that in the course of the Oka there are many whirlpools? And if you look at the tributaries of the Oka, there are many names precisely with the meaning "pit-like," "yama," etc. This name remains in the tributaries.
If you look, for example, at the word Kursk, generally the ending "sk" denoted cities (in the word Lipetsk, "ts" replaces the sound "s"). This is simply an ending that was characteristic of many cities. But the root, which we now see as "kur"... There was a tribe that lived in the forests and constantly burned bonfires, creating hearths, stoves, as it were. They were called "kuryane" – "to smoke" (kurit dym). In the past, "kurit" meant "to emit smoke." And the city of Kursk was named after these ancient tribes.
I want to say that time has no power over many folk names of cities and especially rivers. Are there any more questions?
Sergei: Thank you very much, a very detailed answer, wonderful!
22:40 About the kingdom of Panchala.
Sergei: A significant role in the epic is played by a kingdom such as Panchala. It is known that when Drona decided to take the kingdom from Drupada, he divided the kingdom: he took the northern kingdom for himself, it was called Ahichchhatra, and the southern part went to Drupada. The capital of the Southern Panchala kingdom was called Kampilya.
The question is, where were the kingdom of Panchala and the capital Kampilya geographically located?
Irina: Kampilya was located in the south of the Voronezh region, somewhere between the cities of Kalach and Kantemirovka.
Sergei: Thank you.
23:31 Krishna's appearance.
Sergei: Regarding the population itself, we have learned that these were Indo-European peoples. So, did they look like the current inhabitants of Russia?
Irina: Many tales of the Mahabharata describe Krishna as a blue-eyed and fair-haired man.
Sergei: So, he looked more like a human than a Shimorian?
Irina: His skin color was indeed bluish, but it was lighter than they paint in pictures. And he really did have blue eyes, but, however, they could change depending on his emotional state. When he was in a state of fighting evil, they became almost dark. Otherwise, they were blue.
Sergei: Thank you. Next question.
24:33 Races that participated in the events of the Mahabharata.
Sergei: We know that after the war with Selbet 12 thousand years ago, later on, other colored races began to appear. Did representatives of other colored races – Mongoloid, Negroid, and others – participate in the events described in the epic?
Irina: After what?
Sergei: The colored races, it turns out, appeared after the war with Selbet 12 thousand years ago?
Irina: Yes.
Sergei: During the time of the epic, 5 thousand years ago, were other colored races present on Earth, and what was their role in the internecine war of the Kuru dynasty?
Irina: Yes, they were present on Earth, but not as races, but already as peoples. And some peoples from the south and east came to the territory of the Central Russian Plain and participated not in that battle on the Kursk field, but in other battles that took place. As I already said, the Mahabharata describes many battles.
There were battles where certain peoples, who were representatives of other races, sided with one of the tribes. Such were described.
Sergei: Thank you.
26:12 About Gandhari and her children by Dhritarashtra. Genetic experiments.
Sergei: The next section touches upon the reasons for the split in the Kuru dynasty and the causes of the internecine war.
We have learned that Krishna was a hybrid of an earth woman and a Shimorian. The fact is that the births of Pandu's children and Dhritarashtra's children are described very strangely in the epic. These are precisely the cousins between whom the war took place. We will now try to find out if they were hybrids, like Krishna.
And here's the question: who were Queen Gandhari and her brother Shakuni, who lived in the Gandhara kingdom?
Irina: They were earthlings, but they were in contact with aliens.
Sergei: Thank you.
Gandhari's labor, who gave birth to one hundred sons for Dhritarashtra, is described strangely. Allow me to quote: "Meanwhile, Dhritarashtra had one hundred sons born from Gandhari. And Gandhari carried them in her womb for a full two years. But then she heard that Kunti had given birth to a son, beautiful as the rising sun. Without her husband's knowledge, she ripped open her belly and took out a large, hard lump of flesh.
When Vyasa learned that Gandhari intended to throw away her fruit, borne and produced with such suffering, he hurried to her and ordered one hundred pots of ghee to be prepared, and that the lump should be sprinkled with cold water. Then this lump broke into one hundred parts, and then another part separated, the one hundred and first. Thus her firstborn was Duryodhana."
And here's the question: what did the author of the epic mean by this, and can this image be compared to spawn (eggs) in Gandhari's womb? And who were Duryodhana and his brothers in reality?
Irina: They were the result of experiments by extraterrestrial civilizations that do not come to Earth now. They are in the constellation Lyra. And indeed, they conducted such experiments – crossing earthlings with their own kind, and it didn't always go according to plan. Sometimes a woman couldn't give birth for a long time, sometimes she gave birth to a being that remotely resembled a human. These genetic experiments were not exactly without control, but no one could predict their effect. But aliens, when necessary, provided assistance to such children and corrected the consequences of these experiments, and they managed to keep these children alive. The Spirit was embodied in them, and they lived on Earth. Such cases occurred.
Here one of the experiments and its consequences are described. The fact that she cut open her belly herself is a description; in reality, they performed a Caesarean section on her because she couldn't give birth. And as for the shapeless lump of flesh – it only describes that it wasn't like a human at all. That is, it had, for example, several limbs.
He is showing something with a trunk. What is that? He says it's not a trunk, it's an elongated jaw that formed because the cells divided incorrectly.
Sergei: Very interesting, thank you.
30:19 About the sons of Pandu.
Sergei: The next question concerns the Pandava brothers. Their appearance is also quite unusual. I quote: "Pandu, however, could not become a father and beget children. His sons, five mighty warriors, were born to Kunti and Madri from demigods. At Pandu's behest, his first wife, Kunti, united with the god of justice – Dharma, with Vayu – the god of wind, and Indra – the lord of heaven, and from each bore a son. His second wife, Madri, united with the Ashwin twins and bore twin sons."
Which demigods are referred to in the epic, and were the sons of Pandu hybrids?
Irina: Not all of them. Some were also hybrids with representatives of the constellation Lyra, some were hybrids with the Burhads, and some demigods were described as plasmoids. They were plasmoids, and they were not physical fathers, but they did have sexual relations with women, but only in the Astral.
31:26 Reasons for the war and the split of the Kuru empire.
Sergei: Now we are coming to the conclusion. According to many researchers, one of the reasons for the war in the epic is the usurpation of power. That is, why were the cousins – the children of Dhritarashtra and the children of Pandu – as we have already found out, in some cases genetic experiments – feuding?
What were the true reasons, and what was the influence of extraterrestrial civilizations on the split and strife in the Kuru empire? And who benefited from this war?
Irina: The fact is that in ancient times, the gods, mainly aliens, gave earthlings just laws so that society could develop, including laws on the inheritance of the kingdom. But people did not always obey these laws. For example, there are the "Laws of Manu." This was an analogue not only of the Bible, but generally of the legislative norms of the ancient Proto-Indo-Europeans. What has come down to you today is only a small part.
There were detailed laws about who could inherit and who could not. And one of the laws stated that, for example, if a son inherited a kingdom, he should not try to stake it in gambling. But some did not observe this, and wars happened as a result. That is, one legal heir, following the persuasion of his brother, played (he shows me how they throw dice). Gambling was developed in ancient times because people hoped for luck to win something, they called upon their gods. And sometimes they played for the kingdom.
Succumbing to a momentary weakness, the legal heir lost the kingdom to another. But the one he lost to, according to the laws, should not have used this and taken it; he should have given the opportunity to win back or pay the value of the game. But the loser also had no right to gamble on it. They both broke the law. The people wanted to see Arjuna as king, but he could no longer reign because he had lost his kingdom, and because of this, war happened. His tribe went to war, and the second tribe went to war because they justly considered that they had won. These were related tribes.
The influence of aliens there was only that Krishna did everything to reconcile them. He himself participated in negotiations with the leader of those who went to war. He tried to appeal to his spiritual reason, to explain that it was an illegal game, etc. But no one listened to him; this war took place. When Arjuna tried to refuse the war, saying, "I'd rather give away this kingdom," Krishna reminded him that by this war he was defending the Law. And he also reminded him that it was his karma, as he himself had sown it.
Sergei: Thank you very much.
35:49 About the inhabitants of the serpent kingdom.
Sergei: The next question concerns snakes. In the epic, snakes are mentioned, and it is also known that they had their own kingdom. For example, representatives like Vasuki and Takshaka. Who were these snakes in reality, and what event is implied by the snake sacrifice conducted by King Janamejaya?
Irina: They were earthlings, but they were descendants of even more ancient tribes. About 10 thousand years ago, there were experiments by the reptiloid civilizations of Selbet and its colonies. In some tribes, genetic experiments were conducted, introducing a higher percentage of Selbetian genes into the genotype of earthlings than was prescribed. Many of them were not sanctioned by the Interstellar Union, but nevertheless, children were born. This happened; they even punished these specialists later.
But children were born, and from them, their own peoples originated, as you know. And so – entire tribes. I wouldn't say they were exactly like snakes. But in humans, this was expressed in that they could, for example, be born with a tail, they could be born with vertical pupils, they could be born with a third eyelid, they could be born with fish-like scales. And some even had a face that resembled a reptiloid. Now, at the present moment, all these genetic features are practically reduced to zero, because these descendants interbred with other earthlings, and all these genes have transitioned into an inactive form. But earlier, 5 thousand years ago, this was the case.
That is, these tribes are described as descendants of serpents (nagas).
Sergei: Thank you very much! Very interesting.
38:15 About Rakshasas.
Sergei: Who were the Rakshasas described in the epic as demon cannibals? For example, Hidimba, Ghatotkacha, Baka.
Irina: These were tribes that lived north of that field, somewhere in the area of the Moskva River and further north. They were forest tribes that were robbers – they attacked caravans, looted. And some of these tribes had the custom of human sacrifice.
I want to emphasize that human sacrifice existed in many ancient cultures, and the eating of human flesh was specifically within the framework of ritual – to take on the qualities of that enemy. That is, if they ate people, it doesn't mean there was no food there. It was simply within the framework of a sacred ritual – to acquire the wealth, courage, intelligence of these people whom they considered enemies.
Sergei: Thank you.
39:45 About Krishna's numerous wives and a billion children.
Sergei: In the Bhagavata Purana, it is said that Krishna had 16,108 wives, and that he could simultaneously be with each of them in a separate palace. Was this really the case, and what did they want to convey to us with this?
Irina: The Spiritual world was already described there. Besides the fact that he was a physically incarnated man, hybrid, but a man, he was also Spirit. He was a fairly highly organized Spirit, one of the Arhats of our Galaxy, and he could create thousands of phantoms, which also lived in the Spiritual world and could come to those who loved him – not only women, but also men. And this palace was built by Krishna's thought in the Spiritual world, simply speaking – within the framework of an egregore.
And generally, all this is in the Spiritual world, without a body. That is, every Soul that loves Krishna can be with his phantom and communicate with him forever. And it will seem to her that he is communicating only with her. This, of course, is not so. Because Krishna, like any high-vibrational Spirit endowed with enlightened consciousness, can do this. Christ, for example, can do this, Buddha can do this, Archangels.
Sergei: Additional question. From these wives, he had ten children each, these ten children had ten grandchildren each, thus the number of members in Krishna's family, to which he belonged, reached a billion. This, it turns out, also all relates to the Spiritual world?
Irina: Yes, this relates to the Spiritual world. Although he did have physical children – he had nineteen children from four women. But spiritually, everyone is his child who enters into a special relationship with him, called a parent-child relationship.
That is, in the Spiritual world, the concepts of "father" and "son" mean that the second was born from the first, received spiritual birth. If you receive spiritual birth from some Spirit, that is, this Spirit leads you to enlightenment and the understanding that you are God, then he will be your spiritual father. Likewise, if you lead someone to enlightenment, connect them with the Higher Self, and they feel this for the first time in your presence, then you will be their spiritual father.
Sergei: Thank you.
42:56 About Lord Parashurama.
Sergei: The next question concerns Lord Parashurama: who was he? In the epic, it is also said that he once exterminated all the Kshatriyas. Was this really the case, and why did he do this?
Irina: He was the chief of one of the tribes. I'll look at the map again now. He is showing me – closer to Kazakhstan, beyond the Caspian Sea, southeast.
The Kshatriyas were not a people; they were a separate army, like a knightly order, in your terms. Indeed, there were such battles between different tribes. And, when you said that Parashurama exterminated them, this indicates that he was the leader of this detachment. It doesn't mean that he himself exterminated them; in ancient times, they expressed it that way, naming only the military commander.
There was such a battle for territory in which Parashurama won. But there were also battles where he lost.
Sergei: Thank you.
44:18 About the powerful weapon – the Brahmastra.
Sergei: The epic speaks of the use of magical powerful weapons, for example, the Brahmastra, the use of which leads to enormous destruction. That is, the entire flora and fauna are destroyed, men become infertile, hair falls out, ulcers appear, etc. Is this weapon alien technology? If so, who transmitted it to the Kauravas and Pandavas and why?
Irina: You've probably heard the myth of Prometheus?
Sergei: Yes.
Irina: This is precisely about how, about 10 thousand years ago, one of the aliens, named Prometheus, passed on the secrets of the atomic reaction to the priests of that time. He passed it on for good purposes, so that they could have energy, but what they built was monstrous.
There was a lot of uranium ore, and it glowed in the dark. They built devices from this uranium ore that exploded. That is, first an ordinary fire was lit, and then with the help of phosphorus and a certain amount of sulfur, it reached a certain temperature, and an atomic reaction began. There were huge explosions that subsequently led to everything being contaminated with radiation. Of course, these were not like modern atomic bombs, no, they were much more primitive, but nevertheless, their destructive power was enormous for ancient people.
Indeed, some earthlings began to manufacture such bombs in great secrecy. When the aliens found out about this, an investigation was conducted, and Prometheus was sent to a planet of criminals. In the myths, it is written that he gave fire. But fire had been known for many millennia before Prometheus. It is clear that he gave a special fire.
Sergei: So, it turns out that the characters of the Mahabharata inherited this manufacturing?
Irina: Yes. Several thousand years had passed, and this weapon naturally became known to the inhabitants of central Russia, the Indo-Aryans, as I would call them, their highest priestly class. They also manufactured it, and naturally, Krishna strictly forbade its use.
Sergei: Thank you. Next question.
47:36 About Adityas, Daityas, and Danavas.
Sergei: Who were the Adityas or Suras, the Daityas or Asuras, and the Danavas, who are described as celestials? Why were the Daityas, who were also called anti-gods, in opposition to the Aditya gods?
Irina: You see, the thing is, you need to look at the context. Because celestials could also refer to aliens, based on memories of the war that happened 12 thousand years ago. They clothed all this in myths and thought that the war of the gods was still continuing in the heavens. And also, some believed that they were plasmoids, whom they also deified and called celestials. And the plasmoids fought among themselves for influence over people. Because influence over people is energy.
So, you need to look at the context.
Sergei: Okay, thank you.
48:39 About the process of churning the ocean in the Mahabharata.
Sergei: In the Adi Parva – the first book of the Mahabharata – there is an interesting chapter called "The Churning of the Ocean." I would like to know its meaning, I'll quote now: "Vishnu, in the form of a turtle, places Mount Mandara on his back; the gods and demons tie the serpent Vasuki to it instead of a rope and use him to rotate Mandara, like a churning rod, in the Ocean of Milk, until various wonderful things begin to appear from it: Apsaras (nymphs), a white mythical horse, a precious gem, even the Moon, and finally, the physician of the gods, Dhanvantari, with the drink of immortality, Amrita."
Irina: This is a mythological description of the creation of various Souls, various Galaxies by plasmoid civilizations. For example, the Ocean of Milk. You know that our Galaxy is not called the Milky Way for nothing. That is, it's a creation of stars. Amrita is the drink of immortality. They meant that energy which comes from the Spiritual world and sustains the existence of all.
Sergei: So, this relates specifically to plasmoids. Thank you.
Irina: Yes, they are such plasmoids. But they were also aware of themselves as Spirits. I want to say that plasmoids do not cease to be aware of themselves as Spirits. They are such enlightened beings who were embodied at high levels of density. The fact that they used the serpent specifically to create all this – it was said because of the image of serpent energy. Why was it serpentine? Because a human was recording this, and for humans, serpentine energy, i.e., Kundalini, was the basis of creativity.
Not that this had anything to do with reptiloids. They also have such an understanding that, for example, the word "serpent" is not for nothing a symbol of wisdom, and through this symbol of wisdom, the energy in humans also came to be called "serpentine."
That is, each myth needs to be analyzed to see where it came from.
51:04 Time of events from the Ramayana epic.
Sergei: Then the last question. In the Mahabharata, there are frequent references to the Ramayana and its characters. This is a different epic. Apparently, the events described in the Ramayana are much older than the events in the Mahabharata. Is this really the case? If so, approximately when did they occur?
Irina: The events described in the Ramayana took place precisely in India – both in India and in Russia. There, the territory was more extensive – across the whole Earth, as it were.
Sergei: It is a more ancient epic, yes?
Irina: Yes. This happened around 10 thousand years ago.
Sergei: But not before the war?
Irina: No, after the war.
Sergei: Good. Thank you very much! I also thank our alien friends for the wonderful answers.
Irina: Aranya, thank you! LiShioni, thank you! And I thank you, Sergei, for the interesting questions! Until next time, friends!
March 3, 2024
Conference participants:
Irina Podzorova – contactee with extraterrestrial civilizations, with subtle-material civilizations, and with the Spiritual world;
Sergei Tyukavkin – researcher of ancient Indian mythology;
LiShioni – representative of the planet Shimor, specialist in the astral world and its interactions with the material world;
Aranya – representative of the planet Shimor, specialist in the history of Shimor's interaction with cosmic civilizations, including Earth.
